What Sometimes Happens When People Have Sex Outside of Marriage

April 26, 2012

STDs.

Apparently the executive director of the North Carolina Democratic Party “dated” one of his students, gave her HIV, and then dumped her.

I should say former executive director; he resigned last week over sexual-harassment allegations (different victim).  Likewise he technically only dated his former student; they met when he was her professor at a community college, but began their relationship “Upon completing that class”.  After they found out they had HIV, he apparently also waited a few months before dumping her.

Coverage at Talking Points Memo and the Daily Caller.

I’m just saying, Christianity makes more sense than any of the alternatives.

Hat tip to Rush Limbaugh.

Advertisements

12 Responses to “What Sometimes Happens When People Have Sex Outside of Marriage”

  1. Snoodickle Says:

    What about Judaism?


  2. “I’m just saying, Christianity makes more sense than any of the alternatives.”

    Actually, using protection and being honest with your sexual partners makes more sense than, well, not.

    The guy is a massive moron. Not sure what that has to do with Christianity.


    • STDs spread faster than the knowledge that one has one.

      According to these reports, it appears that by the time he found out he had HIV, she already had it, too. I agree that honesty is great, a very important virtue as far as it goes, but it can’t make up for a lack of other virtues.

      Condoms break. I’ll leave it to the fornicators to discuss among themselves whether sex with a condom is really sex (if you can do so without getting totally gross and inappropriate for mixed company).

      In Christianity, everything holds together and makes sense surprisingly well. When people don’t have a personal relationship with God, don’t try to obey the moral law as traditionally understood, and otherwise don’t live according to Christianity, somehow everything goes out of alignment and there are all these extra problems. It’s almost as if Someone had designed it that way…


      • “STDs spread faster than the knowledge that one has one.”

        Which is why safe sex involves using protection whether you know you have an STD or not.

        “According to these reports, it appears that by the time he found out he had HIV, she already had it, too”

        Which means there are at least three idiots. All three failed to use protection.

        “Condoms break.”

        And when they don’t, they’re nearly foolproof at preventing STDs. The issue is that there should have been a combination of both honesty and the use of protection, like condoms. Had both been used, then none of this would have happened.

        “It’s almost as if Someone had designed it that way…”

        Except I don’t hold to a personal relationship with any deity, don’t obey the moral laws from the Bible, and don’t live according to Christianity. And I’m engaged to be married, disease free and very happy with my life.

        Pointing to idiots acting like idiots doesn’t work to promote your religion unless your religion is the ONLY way that demonstrably keeps people happy and healthy.

      • Snoodickle Says:

        I live according to my own moral code, and I have to say, everything has worked out swell.


      • Your worldview is not consistent with reality.

        “Which is why safe sex involves using protection whether you know you have an STD or not.”

        There’s no such thing as “safe” fornication. The only safe sex is monogamous sex.

        For example, apparently “the most common sexually transmitted disease (STD) in North America” can be transmitted by skin contact (i.e., a condom can’t save you). Sensitive readers should close this window now. From the same source:

        According to the CDC, at least 50% of sexually active men and women will get a genital HPV infection at some point in their lives.

        After a person has been infected, it may take one to three months (or longer in some cases) for warts to appear. Some people who have been infected never get warts. . . .

        Unfortunately, no treatment can kill the virus that causes the warts. Your doctor can remove the warts with laser therapy or by freezing or applying chemicals. Some prescription treatments are available for at home use. Surgery may be necessary for warts that are large or difficult to treat. Still, recurrence remains a problem.

        “‘Condoms break.’
        “And when they don’t, they’re nearly foolproof at preventing STDs. The issue is that there should have been a combination of both honesty and the use of protection, like condoms. Had both been used, then none of this would have happened.”

        By the end of the paragraph, you’ve contradicted what you conceded at the beginning of the paragraph. Condoms are not “safe”.

        “Except I don’t hold to a personal relationship with any deity, don’t obey the moral laws from the Bible, and don’t live according to Christianity. And I’m engaged to be married, disease free and very happy with my life.

        “Pointing to idiots acting like idiots doesn’t work to promote your religion unless your religion is the ONLY way that demonstrably keeps people happy and healthy.”

        If you are or have been a fornicator (I understand you to be saying that you have), you are part of the reason that millions of women today are unhappy, lonely, and increasingly treated like some kind of disposable chattel. The fact that you’ve managed to outsource some of the problems created by your lifestyle to other people doesn’t mean your lifestyle hasn’t created problems.

        Anyway let’s suppose that you’ve somehow dodged every bullet and have no physical, emotional, or spiritual problems resulting from your rejection of God, and that you never will (e.g., divorce). Even so, you’re an anecdote, and the exception. My original point wasn’t that you personally must be very unhappy right now (or, please note, that all Christians are very happy all the time), but that living outside of Christianity tends to run into all these extra problems. The tendency stands.

        As Mark Steyn, Theodore Dalrymple, and others have pointed out, the few people at the top of the intelligence distribution, or the wealth distribution, or (in the parlance of our times) the most “privileged” can often dodge the most obvious consequences of the no-standards lifestyle that is currently popular. The problem, from the point of view of society, is that most people can’t: As noted above, half of sexually active persons will be infected at some point in their lives with that STD alone. 40% of children in America are now born out of wedlock. Divorce rates are high and marriage rates are falling. That’s some serious consequences.

      • Snoodickle Says:

        Chilingworth, you need to lighten up and have some fun. HPV is a joke, there are over 70 strands, the rate of people who contract a strand that actually has consequences is nowhere near 40%. Moreover, almost everyone in the world fornicates at some point before they are married. Is it perfectly safe – of course not, but neither is base jumping, running with the bulls, or juggling flaming swords. Does God not want us to partake in those activities either?

        Also, just because you fornicate doesn’t mean you are rejecting God. You are only rejecting one conception of God, a faith that relies on a book that explicitly condones slavery, condemns people for biological traits, and tells people they are going to suffer for eternity if they don’t convert. My God is not so cruel, and he is perfectly fine with my chosen lifestyle.

        There can be serious consequences to sex, yes, just like there can be serious consequences to almost anything in life that involves risk. Some people, however, choose to live their lives knowing that our time on this Earth is too short to live scared. Shoot, the statistics say that one of the three people that post regularly on this blog will be dead within the next 30 years. If the Mayans have their way, we’ll all be dead before the new year. It’s life man.


      • Aren’t you going to explain to Not a Scientist why, according to him, you are regularly an idiot?

      • Snoodickle Says:

        I only have sex with one woman, so using protection is not an issue. But yes, I disagree with his assessment.


  3. “The only safe sex is monogamous sex.”

    Which is a version of safe fornication. But not the only form.

    “Condoms are not “safe”.”

    Sure they are.

    Cars are safe. That doesn’t mean cars never crash, or there are never accidents.

    “you are part of the reason that millions of women today are unhappy, lonely, and increasingly treated like some kind of disposable chattel.”

    This implies women have no agency of their own.

    Every woman I have had sex with did so of her own will, and enjoyed it at least as much as I did. And I have always treated the women I have been in relationships with as human beings that I respect.

    “The fact that you’ve managed to outsource some of the problems created by your lifestyle to other people doesn’t mean your lifestyle hasn’t created problems.”

    The fact that some people have problems due to certain situations does not mean that all people have problems in similar situations.

    “Even so, you’re an anecdote, and the exception”

    If there are any exceptions, then clearly the god you believe in isn’t all powerful.

    “The tendency stands.”

    No, it doesn’t.

    You claim it does. But you haven’t demonstrated it.

    “the no-standards lifestyle that is currently popular. ”

    My lifestyle isn’t ‘no-standards’. It’s just ‘not Christian’.

    “40% of children in America are now born out of wedlock.”

    And over 80% of people are professing Christians. Seems like the issue isn’t religion.


  4. “Which is a version of safe fornication. But not the only form.”

    OK, good job, hair successfully split. But you’re missing the big picture.

    “Sure they are.

    “Cars are safe. That doesn’t mean cars never crash, or there are never accidents.”

    You can’t have it both ways. The safe-sex people (including you, in these comments—e.g., “Had both been used, then none of this would have happened”) talk as if there were a wonderful world, full of health and happiness, and perfectly safe, that we could all have access to if we could just shrug off benighted old constraints from those silly conservatives.

    You: “And I’m engaged to be married, disease free and very happy with my life.”

    I: “The tendency stands.”

    You: “No, it doesn’t.
    “You claim it does. But you haven’t demonstrated it.”

    What did you think a 50% STD rate was?

    “This implies women have no agency of their own.”

    No, it doesn’t. When we were talking about whether your actions were bad for you, did you think it meant that you didn’t have any agency? People freely choose to do things that are very bad for them all the time. I’m saying that your choice and her choice combine to produce negative consequences for both of you.

    “And I have always treated the women I have been in relationships with as human beings that I respect.”

    One of the few things we’ve (sort of) agreed on so far is honesty. But having sex isn’t like going out to dinner or using a Kleenex; with sex, a statement of love and a promise of fidelity inhere in the act itself. By having sex with a woman, you are implicitly making a promise that includes all of natural-law marriage. In other words, if you fully respected her, you wouldn’t then leave her (among other things). If you were fully honest, you wouldn’t make the promise and then not keep it.

    “‘40% of children in America are now born out of wedlock.’

    “And over 80% of people are professing Christians. Seems like the issue isn’t religion.”

    I think the source of some of our confusion is a failure to think in terms of the very important “to the extent that”.

    Here, I’ll start with an example you’ll agree with:

    To the extent that people use condoms, they are less likely to get an STD.

    —This doesn’t mean that everyone who uses a condom once has an ironclad defense against all STDs ever, but that people who use condoms (more the more consistently they use them) have less chance of getting most STDs.

    To the extent that people accept God, try their best to obey, and let the Holy Spirit fix what’s wrong with them, they will have fewer of these extra problems (e.g., STDs).

    —This doesn’t mean that every professing Christian will be perfect. (In fact, even the most sincere, high-functioning Christians never become perfect within this world—God’s work in us is a lifelong process, and again, in the meantime, a matter of degree.) It does mean that the more people try to live right (and let God do His work, without Whose help we are powerless to live right by our own force of will), the less likely they are to get, e.g., an STD.

    I’m told that “over 90 percent of American adults experience sexual intercourse before marrying,” while “just under 80 percent of unmarried, church-going, conservative Protestants who are currently dating someone are having sex of some sort.” If these numbers are anything like accurate (I assume for purposes of discussion that they are), they show exactly what I’m talking about—Christians are significantly more likely to get it right, but still mess up all the time. *

    Somewhat similarly, people who actually abstain from some bad behavior—e.g., extramarital sex—are significantly less likely to get an STD or sire a child illegitimately. The more nearly they stick to proper behavior (in this case, abstinence), the better their odds.

    * By the way, according to Christianity, we should expect that people would be messing up all the time. That’s why God invented Christianity, so to speak—because we’re all hopelessly fallen and mess up all the time. Some call Christianity “a hospital for sinners”. It’s no argument against the Christian point of view to point out that a lot of professing Christians are doing things they shouldn’t. It would be an argument if you could show that even when people manage to obey what Christianity asks of them (in this case, abstaining from extramarital sex), they are just as likely as those who don’t to have a child out of wedlock somehow anyway.


Agree? Disagree? Thoughts?

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s

%d bloggers like this: