Issue 2 Needs You

November 1, 2011

It’s not too late to make a difference.  Get-out-the-vote efforts will continue through this weekend.  If you’re in Ohio, you can find a volunteer center near you—including address, contact information, and hours—on this map.

I know, I know—you’re busy.  So am I.  So is everyone.  I’m doing this in addition to my full-time job, church, campus-ministry volunteering, and everything else.  

Issue 2 is an important structural reform.  Without it, public-sector unions will continue to drive the growth of government and higher taxes in Ohio for the foreseeable future.  (This should go without saying, but I have nothing personal against the public-sector-union employees; public-sector unions represent a structural problem, however good the intentions of the individual employees.)

If Issue 2 passes, you’ll be able to say you were part of history—as far as I know, other than Wisconsin right before us, no state, having once let public-sector unions in the door, has ever been able to go back.

If Issue 2 fails, at least you’ll know that you did what you could; you won’t have to wonder whether things might have been different if you and others like you had volunteered.

John Derbyshire said curbing public-sector unions was “necessary (or at least a really, really good idea) but utterly impossible”.  Was he right?  It’s up to us to decide.


13 Responses to “Issue 2 Needs You”

  1. Snoodickle Says:

    I don’t really care that much about Issue 2, but I think the argument that public-sector unions are to blame for states’ financial woes is disingenuous. The facts just simply don’t support that claim.

    • I’ll leave it to Tevyeh and Snoodickle to have a more thorough discussion of what’s wrong with the “Center for American Progress”‘s analysis if they’d like, but here’s a rebuttal of one part of it. In short, yes, a simplistic comparison of public-school teachers to private-sector workers with the same number of years of education implies that public-school teachers are underpaid, but not all years of post-secondary education are created equal, by any means; a more complex, more realistic analysis suggests that public-school teachers are actually paid about 50% more than market value for their work.

      • Oh, and yes, the piece I linked to assumes that good teachers can make their students score higher on the SAT, which is incorrect. Ignore that part of it, but what’s left is still an effective rebuttal of the corresponding part of the Center for American Progress’s analysis.

  2. Tevyeh Says:

    Hoo boy…if I have the time in the next few days, I’ll catalogue a sample of the flawed reasoning on exhibit in that article. In any case, Chillingworth’s post doesn’t even mention deficits; the woes he predicts are “the growth of government and higher taxes in Ohio for the foreseeable future.” Moreover, it’s fallacious to attribute budget deficits to revenue shortfalls while giving state expenditures (including salaries) a free pass. A deficit is by definition an imbalance between these two variables, and an argument that one or the other variable is to blame is like an argument over which blade of a pair of scissors does the cutting.

    • Snoodickle Says:

      Flawed reasoning or not, the core point the article makes is spot on – that public sector salaries and benefits are not growing at an unsustainable rate. Also, where did I mention Chillingworth in my post? I was merely pointing out that the prevailing conservative argument against public sector unions is dead wrong. Chillingworth makes some sound structural arguments against public sector unions, but unlike most conservatives does not mention deficits. It’s unclear what his view is on that. You should read more carefully.

  3. unclereeky Says:

    I have to ask this question…What makes the position of Teacher, Police Officer or Fireman anymore important than say..a factory worker or an accountant. When I heard that those 3 professions in Ohio got on the average 43% for in pay and benefits than other workers in Ohio..this aggravated me. They are paid by our tax dollars..therefore, the taxpayers should have a say in this..or..have the state make these same benefits available to all the other workers who aren’t employed by the state. Teachers only work part of the year…I see police cars at UDF, McDonalds..and what does a fireman do if their not fighting fires…all I know is..they are still getting paid..when their not teaching..when their sitting at UDF and when their not fighting fires. I don’t know about you..but when I was working..I couldn’t go to UDF or McDonalds or take 3 months off..or just sit around and wait until something happened before I started working. I’ve had some pretty good paying jobs in my life..but to hear that state paid workers were getting 43% more in pay and benefits..I just couldn’t believe it. We, as tax payers, need to get more of an understanding on how the state figures the wages for its employees..what is good for them is just as good for all workers. Vote yes on Issue Two…lets make sure our tax dollars are going to something that benefits something other than state employees. Schools, not teachers, are in need of monies, roads need repaired, I could go on and on.
    In closing, I have just one more issue I have to get off my back. I graduated in 1980…I had a teacher who had taught for what I was told, 5 years before I was taught by this person. This teacher is still teaching…for a total of 37 years this teacher has been filling the place of a young teacher trying to find a job…Tenure is not suppose to lock out teachers, policeman or fireman…especially when the teachers, policeman and fireman with tenure use it as an excuse to do les and less. I’ve seen it first hand.


    • Snoodickle Says:

      You do have a say, sir, you can vote yes on Issue 2. That’s how democracy works.

    • If Issue 2 doesn’t pass, government employees’ wages and benefits will continue to be set in significant part by the employees themselves, through their unions, rather than by us, through our elected representatives. We’re trying to restore “how democracy works”.

      • Snoodickle Says:

        Yes, but if Issue 2 does not pass, the people have decided that is the way they want things.

  4. Eric Says:

    Every commercial I see pertaining to Issue to sounds like a threat. “If Issue 2 fails, will we be able to save your house if it’s burning down?”…or.. “If your house is getting robbed, will the police department get their in time or have enough personnel to solve the case?”…or…”If Issue 2 a I supposed to teach to the best of my ability?”. They have made these commercials all pertain to personnel when we all know the collective bargaining mostly pertains to how much they can get paid! This is why it need to pass so we don’t have teachers, policeman and fireman bargaining for how much we can pay them. Like I said before..teachers don’t teach year round….I see policeman in the United Dairy Farmer store everyday…fighting crime?? And last but not least..the fireman..what are they doing when their not fighting fires.I went to my local fire station to see..they wouldn’t even allow me in to see. Figures..we paid for it..why would they let me in to see it??(sarcasm). One point that really gets me. I was military for ten years..which today, I feel is one of the most important jobs in the world. For all you military and vets, we all know the pay scale in the military..I don’t know of anyone that got rich in the military. The pay stinks..yes..your there to defend your country. So I say if the fireman, policeman and teachers get 43% more pay & benefits than the average worker, then why doesn’t the military rate that kind of pay?
    This issue has to pass. Think about it..Blue flu..teachers striking, unions always striking..these are the people who use collective bargaining. I know that every job I’ve ever had was against even mention lost your job. So take this point to bed with you..sleep on it, think about it. Think about all the strikes you’ve ever seen or heard about. Were they striking because they needed more people or were they striking because they wanted more pay. COLLECTIVE BARGAINING is done mainly to get government or union workers more money..not more help!!


    • Snoodickle Says:

      Sir, I think you would be a great spokesman for the campaign in support of Issue 2.

      • unclereeky Says:

        Thank you very much. I am very determined to see this issue come true. Even though it was defeated in November..its not over. It didn’t pass the first time in Wisconsin either. People will wake up and will do the right thiing. How much more money will the unions put up to keep things the way they are? To get more money, they will have to ask more of their unions..and even Union workers have a limit to just how much they will give. I am very sure, that in the very near future..we will see Issue 2 or an issue like it pass..and I hope its sooner rather than later.
        Thanks again for the compliment.


      • In fact, the process has already started to make Ohio a right-to-work state—that is, to put that question before Ohio voters next November. I don’t know whether that counts as “an issue like it”—this would be a blow to all unions, not just public-sector ones—but we may have a big fight all over again next year. So it’s on.

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